Western riding

[Bek B]

I've been watching a few videos of QH ridden Western style. Really fascinating to watch, the horses seems to perform effortlessly to the lightest of aids.

What was really apparent was the 'outline' (there's that word again) that the horses work in. Its very long and low and from a classical point of view on the forehand. I wondered why this should be and I'd love to hear any knowledge/ideas.

When I thought about Western riding in terms of its original application (working ranches, long days in the saddle etc) it does seem to make sense anatomically. The long and low posture means that the nuchal ligament is holding the back up and supporting the rider. This nuchal ligament is intended to passively carry the horses abdominal mass for hours on end during grazing. It seems logical that if you want a horse to work all day long that you should harness this passive system?

Thinking out loud, but would love to hear the thoughts of others.

[daytona]

Agree, when I was out in Montana the horses really are encouraged to work very long and low this also helps with the type of terrain you have to ride over. Its not just flat out there and the horses can cope better with balance as you havent a rider pulling on reins etc to distract the horse can feel its own way.
You have to ride more with your body and the slightest shift in body weight and the horses react to this which when chasing cattle you need that quick reaction - you dont need the reins these just interfere and when you are roping you have different reins so nothing gets tangled up.
I feel this type of riding is so much better and encourages the rider to actually hold themselves too many people think you can just slouch but you still have to be able to have a sturdy core but you also need to be more relaxed.

[black crow]

Wtf i replied to this yesterday?

[Bek B]

Wtf i replied to this yesterday?

Argh, has you post gone awol.

Would love to hear your comments BC.

[black crow]

Try again lol

For a lot of western horses, their focus is on remaining quick and nimble on the ground. They arent needed to tower on their haunches to have a light forehand.
If western riders had their horses collected on a tight rein/solid contact, they would no doubt lose most if not all impulsion when their horse was needed to turn. Because a lot of the movements seen in western performance all came from working ranches, the horses need to be quick and agile to steer cattle. Simply, the horse needs to be able to do the work themselves, not be guided every step of the way.
A lot of people think you ride like the cowboys in the films, sadly it’s very misleading. You often seen many ‘riders’ with over long reins, clacking and whipping at the horse with the ends, galloping with the horse gaping at the bit, drop the contact, then haul your hand up into your chest to get them to stop. Horse throws their head up and looks ‘wild’ and if you want to turn, you haul your weight to the inside, hand goes to the other side of the neck and big kick. Very wrong!
To turn a correctly trained western ridden horse, your hand wants to stay on the correct side of the neck. If you pull your hand over the middle of the neck, you are technically trying to turn them the other way. Its about neck reining, not neck and bit!

I believe a lot of the characteristics are bred into them. Many QH or Appendix horses are very 'low' built. Without the debate of the niggles of the QH breed, many of them are small, but huge horses. You often see many only around 15hh carrying 16 stone men, who in an English school, would be put on nothing smaller than a Clydesdale. Because of this, a lot of western horses are born with the ‘low’ frame already. Purpose breeding I suppose. Also, the herding is a major part of their blood line. Although horses aren’t herding [other] animals by nature it still does imply parts of what they know with their own species. Quick turns to drive in a direction. So in effect it’s also using what the horse knows best. You can see so much of the breed characteristics in the size of QH haunches especially.
Horses still need to work from behind, but they need to learn to carry themselves in a low frame. Unlike the cowboys horses, most of them don’t gallop around with their head in the air. But of course it wont look dramatic in the films if the horses travelled with their heads down! (also think to traditional English carriages, horses heads held into the air for fashion, it’s a similar trend!)
Like English not all the training methods are very nice. Western horses have their range of gadgets too, especially many that are used on the cinch to keep their heads low, or a two way rein. You can ride on a tighter contact to teach them to be responsive, but also have the rein hanging down to give the counter effect of what you want them to ride on. Gradually you can slacken the tighter rein and use both, and then the lower. In effect it’s almost like a draw rein, but much less harsh and not connected. The most common western gadget is the standing martingale.
You also have to work with the horses association. If you don’t want them to only respond to a hard tug on the rein, they need to learn that the weight and leg aids correspond with the left rein – they find it easier to turn to the right, and gradually recognise that a weight aid and rein on the left side of the neck means turn right ( the easier option) then to go against the weight aid which is not as comfortable.
Going on these basics you can then teach the horse the complex moves like spins. This is why polework is used so much with western horses too. I used to go to some western practices where we would work with little platforms getting the horses to walk on and off, and around cones and poles. It helps supple them up but most importantly to get them to really respond to the reins.

Back to the point though lol the horses also have to carry large riders over a lot of country. If the horse was held on a tight rein in a contact for so long, it would no doubt tire both horse and rider. You want the horse to conserve as much energy as possible when following herds of cattle for several days back to the farms. So letting the horse pick their own path is often a good way of letting them keep in reserves. Riding on the ‘long and low’ also means your not having to grab up the reins, squeeze in the impulsion to get the horse to take off after a cow. You can just pick up the reins a little and squeeze/kick on and off you go.
I’ve seen quite a few tiny little children up on big 15hh horses. Because many are neck reined almost entirely, tiny children can actually ride them by just the reins only. Something over here would be quite taboo if a 5 year old boy was seen riding a 15hh horse on his own!
Many of the horses are technically even in withers and point of croup/loins, but are build with a very ‘downhill’ frame. This can be seen in horses outside of ranches. If you look at ‘hunt seat’ horses, many of the riders work in a ‘pivoted on knees’ position [which points the toes out] with their bum right out behind them, and the horse is working with a straight neck. I helped retrain a huntseat horse a few years ago, and it was quite a strange experience. Mainly as when we started jumping him, the neck remained pretty high up, and not ‘following’ the movement. He didn’t fully drop onto the bit, but we managed to get him working a little more uphill with a bit of flexion in his neck. Many huntseat horses learn to be supple, but he was very very wooden.

Back to the point about sliding stops lol if you have a look at some photographs of champion western performance horses displaying the sliding stop, you will notice not many of them are ‘gaping’ at the bit, yet are fully down on their haunches. It takes great strength in their latissimus dorsi and trapezius muscles to be able to keep their balance, keep the rider on board, and to be able to 180% spin and lope off. If the horse was on the bit, i don’t think many would really be able to pull something off like this. But a muscular neck, shoulders and back really do help. I think it also helps that the western saddles are much wider and spread the weight more on the horses back, so it’s less pressure in one place.

Also, the bits play a big part. You will find some horrifically severe bits in western world, and most of them are gags. The gags arent used that often, but when the horse is required to stop, and stop immediatley, the bit comes into action. It's basically no bit pressure = good, strong bit pressure = STOP. Whereas for english riders, we ride as a consistent contact so when we would like to stop or slow down, we're not relying on so much pressure on the tongue and bars in one go


Think I’ll stop there :p


Rambled on a bit but hope that makes some sense lol

[Bek B]

Interesting, thanks BC

[Beth]

Hi i have just come home this week from working 9 months in Montana (America) as a ranch hand on a cattle ranch and its a whole different horse culture :0) Western riding was so comfortable for all day in the saddle I would definatley get one over here but so heavy.

beth

[daytona]

Hi i have just come home this week from working 9 months in Montana (America) as a ranch hand on a cattle ranch and its a whole different horse culture :0) Western riding was so comfortable for all day in the saddle I would definatley get one over here but so heavy.

beth

Ooo that sounds great Beth.
Where abouts did you work. My friends are in Bridger just south of Billings.
I love Montana def one of my fave places.

[Beth]

I was on the prairie on the canadian boarder near cut bank. cold with lots of snow blizzards. hard work but glad i experienced it. yes montana can be beautiful :0)