Side Saddle

[Beth]

Hi, does anyone on here do side saddle? either have lessons or have their own? I find that very few people know much about side saddle and where to go for lessons. Also does anyone on here show in side saddle?

I have had two lessons in side saddle and read all i can about it but i am now looking for a class around gloucester. I would love anyone on here to share their knowledge of side saddle.

[CityLights]

One of the few things i havent really done, sat in one once about three years ago at pony club camp but other than that not much experience with it, im sure someone on here does though im sure i remeber seening pictures of someone in side saddle

side saddles are very tricky to get hold of apparently and also very difficult to fit to the horse due to being sat on the side the balance is very tricky to get right, must be very interesting to try and get one to fit

[piccolo]

Ooo, i'd love to have a go! Could you not google something like the "side saddle organisation", they might have a list of places:).

[XenaWarriorPrincess]

Ive ridden side saddle once, found it killed my back but i have bad posture anyway so that was probably why! Im also not very elegant :lol: So felt awkward!!
The haffy i was riding kept bucking though :pmsl: and i found it very secure, i barely moved!!

[Beth]

There is The Side Saddle Assosiation but that is mostly for people who compete i believe and I dont have my own horse yet just ride other peoples and at the moment im just looking into riding schools that do side saddle, which is proving very hard to find one as the one i went to was quite far away.

[sidesaddlevic]

Hi Beth, I ride side saddle regularly. Have lessons once a week with Roger Phiillpot - he is based in Kineton, Warwickshire and runs a riding school there specialising in side saddle, however he also teaches a lot away from the yard - ie. people with their own horses.

Been riding side saddle a little undr a year and LOVE it. I have done some competitions and was lucky enough to go to the national side saddle show at Addington this summer with one of Roger's horses. However, i'm not bit into competing, i jusy enjoy riding side saddle and doing something a bit different.

You are true, there are not a lot of people around who do sidce saddle and there are many misconceptions about side saddle, however i have been lucky enough to spend a lot of time (probably way too much) on the yard with Roger and also Liz Rogers (5 times side saddle rider of the year) and heave learnt sooo much.

Please shout if you have any questions - probably wont be able to answer them myself but am more than happy to ask at the yard. I have recently got a new horse of my own who i am hoping to break to side saddle after christmas so will be asking 1000's questions myself!!

vic

[Westy]

There's another Beth ('Bess') on here who rides side saddle, I'll point her this way. I think she's done some local level shows in the past. It looks good fun and very elegant.

I've had lessons with one of the Urchinwood instructors who teaches side-saddle there (may be the only one, not sure) and she's very good for the normal stuff so I can second the recommendation for Urchinwood. Nice place, but you'll want a car if coming down from Glos - it's a mission by public transport.

Side Saddle Assoc isn't just for competitive types, and if you make contact with your local area then I'm sure they'll be able to suggest places around Gloucester that you can go to. I'd hope there's somewhere a tad closer than Bristol. What you might find is that there are freelance instructors who operate out of different riding schools as and when they can, rather than a school having a dedicated set up. I think Urchinwood is a bit of an exception - seem to recall my instructor saying they had 2 saddles but only 2 horses that they fitted and could do it.

Smile & Wave: I've found sidesaddles *too* easy to get hold of. For some bizarre reason I own one of the blinking things! Despite not riding sideways (well,intentionally at least...) nor owning a horse!! I blame my OH... :miffed: (:rose:)

[Bess]

Hello Beth!

Only just seen this, I learnt to ride side saddle about 4 years ago ish...and love it! I no longer have a horse but my old seemed very happy with a side saddle and relaxed alot more with one than an astride saddle.

I've competed in a few local shows, nothing fancy but it was lots of good fun. I've never competed against anyone else side saddle, everyone else was astride so I received alot of funny looks and glares. I've never ridden in the full habit either. I just ride side saddle to have fun, we use to hack out that way and never had any problems. With my old side saddle I always had to ask some random stranger on a hack to do my girth up (looks of worried looks off blokes). Luckily with my new one, it's an outside girthing system so won't have that problem.

I think one of the misconceptions of riding side saddle is you have to be very keen on showing and competing. I would like to do the whole hog one day, but I enjoy just hacking about and my instructor was quite happy to teach us with no major aims...apart from being able to get my old horse to leg yield (she was a stubborn, lazy girl, bless her).

The Side Saddle Association isn't just for those serious about competing. It's for anyone interested. I'm a member and you get to know other people who ride side saddle local to you. It's also good for when you want to find a saddle and a habit. You'll be able to find a freelance instructor through them too.

I'm moving to Bristol at the end of this year (I live in Shropshire at the mo) so intend to go to Urchinwood Stables at some point. I might even see you there. Like Vic I've been to Pittern Hill for a lesson with Roger and it was brilliant.

I've never had a problem finding side saddles, if anything it's been too easy lol. I currently have 3 (just been donated a pony's side saddle). My lastest addition is a 3 year old Rob Jenkins saddle which is lovely (on loan at the mo). I think the reason why I've never had a problem finding them is because I like Irish Draughts and the majority of old saddles were made for these horses for hunting. Side saddles for ponies, cobs and horses without a good broad wither are a bit more difficult to get hold of. You just have to make sure you get a saddler who knows what they are talking about with a side saddle, they fitting is vital to the horse and rider. Rob Jenkins is in Worcestershie (I think) so he would be the closet to you!

Sorry I've rambled on and on! Keep us updated how you get on, I'm missing riding side saddle. Also if you look at the website Ride 2 the Side they are brilliant for advice and info.

Have fun!

[Beth]

Hi I found something interesting for those interested in period costume and traditional riding habits on the net. - Side Saddle Lady Museum
History of Riding Habits
An Overview

can anyone tell me why the riding habit currently used is fashioned from the 1930s? or so im told with the top hat and bowler hat too.

Thanks for all the replies everyone its great to find others interested in side saddle too. I will look up the schools you recomend. lets keep this up and keep talking because im learning from it and im sure others are too. :0)

[Bess]

The riding habit from the 1930's came into fashion with the increase in women hunting. The apron (skirt part) wraps around you as such, so if you get caught in a hedge etc the apron would rip off. So essentially for safety reasons. The habit has stayed in fashion since, more for showing and still for hunting. You were an bowler hat in the morning for showing and in the afternoon you wear a top hat. The Side Saddle Association handbook has loads of info on numerous rules and traditions on what to and not what to wear. I know that you're not meant to wear a red waistcoat for some historical and traditional reason, can't think what it is now lol.

The side saddles we use today only really came into fashion in the 1920's. Prior to this women literally sat side ways, with no pommels and only a metal railing around the saddle, hence also why the 1930's habit came into use with the pommel saddles being made. Orginally women were never meant to trot on a side saddle, only walk and canter because it was seen as more elegant.

I'll have a look in some of the books I have on side saddle history, can't remember off by heart!

Have lots of fun!

[Beth]

When buying a horse with a view to doing side saddle what would you look for? and would you have to go for a specific typ of horse? or one that was already trained in side saddle? Or maybe at an age where it can still learn? even though i have heard that many horses take very well to side saddles. Would you have to take them to further training?

questions questions :0)

[clippi]

Hey welcome back Bess - not seen you on hear for ages. I would say that any type of horse is Ok, my horse and Bess's horse were very different and yet they both took to it, I prefered astride which is why I stopped. You can rent saddles I used a very good lady down in devon who came and fitted the saddel to Clippi

[Bess]

Only just looked at this! Hi Clippi :)

I think any horse can adapt to a side saddle. From what seen the bigger horses like IDs tend to be used more for side saddle. My old horse was quite useful in the fact she had a broad wither so alot of side saddles tended to fit her. Plus she was quite long in the back. Alot of saddle on the market are for bigger horses. My old horse was 17 when she first had a side saddle on her, so age is no limit. But it's recommended you start a young horse with a side saddle at about 7/8 years old. As long as you have a saddle that fits the horse, than you'll be fine. Don't listen to all the tales that say a side saddle ruins a horses back, so does an astride saddle that isn't fitted properly. It also must fit you as well, I never thought this was important until I started trying side saddles and it definately makes a difference.

My old instructor always said the ideal horse would be calmer one, but I've seen plenty of fizzy ones riding side saddle. As long as your horse isn't a known rearer you're fine. If they rear you could end up going backwards more than you would on an astride. Good luck!

[sidesaddlevic]

I have literally just started breaking my new horse to side saddle (Bess - we were hoping Harry's old saddle would fit him, but sadly it was too big!!) He is a 10 year old, ex racer TB, and he is taking to it well. He has only had the saddle on twice, but we have walk, trot and cantered on both reins. Have a lot of work to do, but he seems to be accepting it well - i am so proud of him. I have spent a lot of time making sure his schooling is good as i think this makes a big difference when coming to putting the side saddle on. I am now looking forwrad to moving on with him, and planning to be reasy for the National Side Saddle show in August!!

V

[Bess]

Awwww, that's great news about your horse Vic! That's good he's cantering on both reins already, Syb took ages to master the left rein (and me, just two of combined together were hopeless to begin with). I still think of Harry, it's sooooo sad! He was lovely, although grumpy! Let me know how you get on. x

[Clair-lou]

I too love sidesadlle as I'm very big on period dramas and want to recreated the splendor that adorned the ladies and their horses :)

I never knew there were competitions and I've never seen in 'real life' anyone riding side saddle so I would be facinated to go to such a show and/or a school that offers lessons.

I live in Staffs is there anyone near me that teaches it??

Clair xxx

[fairyfeet]

I used to ride side saddle years ago. Loved it. Showed, jumped and hunted! Once you get used to it, its very secure and oh so elegant!
The saddle needs to be fitted to you aswell as the horse, as the parts that keep your legs in position have to be in the right place and the right size.

[Beth]

Has anyone done Concours D'elegance? what are some of the rules? is there an age limit and what you can wear? I hear its an amazing show of costumes from all through history or just the theatrical.

[Sidesaddlelady]

I too love sidesadlle as I'm very big on period dramas and want to recreated the splendor that adorned the ladies and their horses :)

I never knew there were competitions and I've never seen in 'real life' anyone riding side saddle so I would be facinated to go to such a show and/or a school that offers lessons.

I live in Staffs is there anyone near me that teaches it??

Clair xxx
Hi Claire,

If you contact the Side Saddle Association they will send you a list of instructors in your area. Have a look at their web-site for contact details:

http://www.sidesaddleassociation.co.uk/contact.htm

I ride SS in "real life". I don't compete as I'm just a happy hacker. I started about 15 years ago as a result of reading an article in the old "Riding" magazine. I knew my great grandmother had hunted side saddle, but like you didn't know anyone other than the Queen ever did it in modern times!

When I first started pottering around the lanes and bridle paths in my area on side saddle on my 16.2 Irish Draught gelding we caused quite a lot of interest - comments like "Has that lady had her leg cut off?" (from a small child)- "Are you the Queen then?" (Man outside pub - he didn't offer me a drink though!) - but they all ignore me now.

Contrary to general opinion, side saddle is a very safe way of riding. Your seat is much more secure than astride and you can do anything side saddle that you can do on an astride saddle.

The modern habit isn't anything like you see in period dramas. It's smart and practical and the skirt is an apron rather than a full skirt. When competing, etc., you wear a bowler or a top hat if you are competing in the afternoon, except when you are jumping in which case you wear a standard hard hat for safety reasons.

A habit is only required if you are hunting or showing or doing anything formal (although the apron is nice and warm in winter). Normally I wear full seat breeches because the seams on the knee strapping on jodhs tends to rub behind the knee (it's useful to wear tights underneath for the same reason). I wear long boots because I always do. Half chaps are not a good idea because the zip and fastenings on the inside can damage valuable saddles. When you are having lessons baggy tops prevent the instructors seeing how you are sitting so you are better in a fitted shirt or jumper or your hacking/show jacket if you have one.

If you want to see it in action have a look at the Ride2theside website for a list of their displays.

http://www.ride2theside.co.uk

They are based in Cheshire so they are likely to be doing a display somewhere near you in the summer. A lot of local and county shows have side saddle classes. There is also the Northern Side Saddle Group which does Have a go sessions.

Go for it and enjoy yourself

[Sidesaddlelady]

Ive ridden side saddle once, found it killed my back but i have bad posture anyway so that was probably why! Im also not very elegant :lol: So felt awkward!!
The haffy i was riding kept bucking though :pmsl: and i found it very secure, i barely moved!!

It's a bit uncomfortable when you start because you are using muscles differently than when you are riding astride. You may also have been on a saddle that didn't fit you. In fact, because there is a lot of concentration on your seat, it can often improve posture.

Horses often behave better under side saddle as your seat is secure and you can concentrate on the horse with less worry about staying on. My grandfather used to school difficult horses in side saddle for this very reason.

[Sidesaddlelady]

One of the few things i havent really done, sat in one once about three years ago at pony club camp but other than that not much experience with it, im sure someone on here does though im sure i remeber seening pictures of someone in side saddle

side saddles are very tricky to get hold of apparently and also very difficult to fit to the horse due to being sat on the side the balance is very tricky to get right, must be very interesting to try and get one to fit

There are side saddles around. The best ones are those built in the first half of the 20th century. Older and they may not be of the modern style and may have fixed roller bar fittings for he stirrup which is dangerous. The most famous makes are Champion and Wilton, Owen and Mayhew, although there are many other saddles of the same vintage made by local saddlers that are just as good.

There are some new saddles around but you have to be VERY careful. There are some which come up on Ebay regularly, described as German but in actual are made in the far east and are not made on a side saddle tree - dangerous again. There IS a german side saddle made by Karl Niedersuss which was produced with input from the SSA and Roger Philpott, I think. However, it is VERY expensive. The last one I saw was priced at nearly £5000.

There are a lot of people who hire out side saddles quite reasonably (the SSA may be able to help with info here) and this is a much better idea than buying when you are first starting out and if you find the perfect saddle for your horse and yourself you might be able to persuade the persn hiring it to sell it to you.

A word of warning NEVER buy a side saddle without having it inspected by a specialist. The side saddle market is fraught with man-traps for the unwary. Apart from the facts that a badly fitting saddle means a bad back for your horse, a faulty saddle can be dangerous and a damaged one is very expensive to repair - it can cost as much to repair a damaged cheap saddle as it would have done to buy a good quality sound one. There are a lot of side saddles advertised as fit for use when all they are fit for is to decorate a country pub. You are spending a lot of money and you need to get value for that money.

[Sidesaddlelady]

Hi I found something interesting for those interested in period costume and traditional riding habits on the net. - Side Saddle Lady Museum
History of Riding Habits
An Overview

can anyone tell me why the riding habit currently used is fashioned from the 1930s? or so im told with the top hat and bowler hat too.

Thanks for all the replies everyone its great to find others interested in side saddle too. I will look up the schools you recomend. lets keep this up and keep talking because im learning from it and im sure others are too. :0)
The "modern" habefore the modern apron was designed but they were largely unsuccessful.

[Sidesaddlelady]

Hi I found something interesting for those interested in period costume and traditional riding habits on the net. - Side Saddle Lady Museum
History of Riding Habits
An Overview

can anyone tell me why the riding habit currently used is fashioned from the 1930s? or so im told with the top hat and bowler hat too.

Thanks for all the replies everyone its great to find others interested in side saddle too. I will look up the schools you recomend. lets keep this up and keep talking because im learning from it and im sure others are too. :0)

The "modern" habit was designed in the last century and has lasted because it was desiged for the job and it works - "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" as the old saying goes. It's smart, practical and safe and fit for purpose. Safe is not exactly what its predessors were. In the days of flowing skirts if ladies fell their skirts often got caught up in the saddle they were dragged. There were several attempts to design a safety skirt but none were very successful until the modern apron was introduced.

As for hats, before the 17th century ladies rode in ordinary day costume. When formal riding costume began to appear in the mid-1600s, it was fashionable for ladies to wear headgear in the style of the men's hats of the time and this has continued to be the case. Bowlers and top hats became the norm in the 19th century. Ladies' riding dress came more and more to reflect the style of men's clothing and now ladies' astride riding clothes are indistinguishable from mens. In fact bowler and top hats are still worn by ladies in certain astride disciplines, eg upper level dressage riders wear top hats and until rules about safety helmets were introduced ladies showed in bowler hats in classes where "rat catcher" was the correct form of dress.

[Sidesaddlelady]

The riding habit from the 1930's came into fashion with the increase in women hunting. The apron (skirt part) wraps around you as such, so if you get caught in a hedge etc the apron would rip off. So essentially for safety reasons. The habit has stayed in fashion since, more for showing and still for hunting. You were an bowler hat in the morning for showing and in the afternoon you wear a top hat. The Side Saddle Association handbook has loads of info on numerous rules and traditions on what to and not what to wear. I know that you're not meant to wear a red waistcoat for some historical and traditional reason, can't think what it is now lol.

The side saddles we use today only really came into fashion in the 1920's. Prior to this women literally sat side ways, with no pommels and only a metal railing around the saddle, hence also why the 1930's habit came into use with the pommel saddles being made. Orginally women were never meant to trot on a side saddle, only walk and canter because it was seen as more elegant.

I'll have a look in some of the books I have on side saddle history, can't remember off by heart!

Have lots of fun!

Bess, I'm afraid you are somewhat muddled about side saddle history. The saddle you describe where the lady actually sat sidewards with her feet on a planchette was becoming unfashionable by the end of the mediaeval period. A form of pommel was introduced in the 16th cenrury and is attributed to Catherine De Medici, Queen of France. Gradually the single pommel was developed into two by the late 19th century and in the early 1900s the major London makers had introduced safety stirrup leather fittings which made side saddle riding much safer.

The developments in the 19th century came about mainly because women began to be more actively involved in hunting largely as a result of the example of Empress Elizabeth of Austria, who hunted in England and was something of a "neck or nothing" rider. Formerly ladies had usually ridden to the meet and either watched the hunt from a safe distance or ridden with a pilot who guided them over the safer fences.

[Sidesaddlelady]

When buying a horse with a view to doing side saddle what would you look for? and would you have to go for a specific typ of horse? or one that was already trained in side saddle? Or maybe at an age where it can still learn? even though i have heard that many horses take very well to side saddles. Would you have to take them to further training?

questions questions :0)

Basically, all horses are suitable for side saddle and you should chose a good horse for the particlar thing you want to do, as you would if buying a hrorse to ride astride in a particular discipline - eg if you want to hunt you can't do better than an Irish Draught or an ID cross. However, most people have to manage with what they've got. The important thing to look for is a good shoulder.

In the heyday of ladies riding side saddle it was said that mares were best as they were perceived to have longer back which suited the side saddle better than a short-backed horse. This has largely been disregarded now.

It used to be held that 15.3hh was the tallest horse suitable for a lady but this was when women were generally not as tall as they are now. Modern women are less likely to look over-horsed on a taller horse, even with the extra hand's height that the side saddle give you.

Ladies' horses were expected to be well-mannered and safe with a smooth action. They were trained to go from walk to canter and back and not to trot. This had nothing to do with decorum but because sitting trot on a side saddle is bl**dy uncomfortable and rising trot is worse! Unfortnately, you are now expected to trot when showing

As far as practical issues are concerned, because riding was usually the prerogative of the better-off lady who rode thoroughbreds, it can be difficult to find older side saddles to fit cobs and similar types especially as both horses and ladies tend to be bigger these days. Arabs, too, can be difficult due to their conformation. However, there are plenty of people riding and competing these types and a good side saddler can overcome a lot of difficulties.

The one horse who should NEVER be ridden side saddler is a rearer. Because your weight is furher back you risk pulling the horse over backwards and being trapped under him when he comes down

[Sidesaddlelady]

Has anyone done Concours D'elegance? what are some of the rules? is there an age limit and what you can wear? I hear its an amazing show of costumes from all through history or just the theatrical.
There is Concours d'Elegance and there is costume Concours d'Elegance - you confuse them at your peril! The former judges horse and rider in "modern" tack and riding habit and the latter judges historically accurate costume. Any aspect of theatricality or fancy dress is frowned on.

At lower level shows you can get away with modern tack and just historically accurately outer garments. However, at a higher level I have seen judges lift competitors' skirts and inspect their underwear for historical accuracy! Judges don't usually judge on the basis of historically accurate saddles because of the safety aspects of antique saddles but I did once see a judge cut up rough because a girl was dressed very accurately as Anne of Bohemia but riding on a modern side saddle when the judge said it should have been a mediaeval saddle with a planchette for her feet -where the hell the girl was supposed to find a planchette saddle the judge didn't say!

The Side Saddle Association National Show has both types of class and sometimes a fancy dress class as well.

[Sidesaddlelady]

I seem to have got a bit carried away here. I can bore for England on side saddle!

Sorry :o

[Sidesaddlelady]

"Bump" in case anyone is interested